earlysda
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Author Topic: 7 thunders anyone??  (Read 1074 times)
NB
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« on: February 26, 2010, 10:24:38 PM »

Anyone interested in a study of the 7 thunders??   Grin
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earlysda
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« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2010, 06:07:55 AM »

I thot that was a very cryptic subject, meaning "it was a deliniation of events to transpire under the 1st and 2nd Angels' Messages".  Do you have more light on the subject than just that?
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NB
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« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2010, 05:48:11 PM »

unfortunately some of the hits for this topic I do not trust as pure....  going to the older original works have revealed something quite different...
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earlysda
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« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2010, 06:36:54 PM »

All ears then  Smiley
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NB
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« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2010, 07:23:12 PM »

it is a long post....  and not in stone yet ...  it is just a study that has worked itself out and so it is an ongoing study.... 

I have not used anything that has come from rewritten versions like the GC 1911 or manuscript releases even though there are many things there that could be a part of this but I choose not to trust those sources for obvious reasons.  If I cannot find it elsewhere, I will not use it..... 
MR hits on 7 thunders do not match original works of EGW but actually match some of the pioneer writings...  it was stated in MR that the thunders would occur during the 1 and 2nd angel's messages and therefore would have already happened in the past.....as 1844 began the 3rd message.  This statement was not found anywhere in the originals or pure books of EGW.

This is how I understand it today.....
« Last Edit: February 28, 2010, 07:46:40 PM by NB » Logged
NB
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« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2010, 07:41:12 PM »

These first few quotes show how the voice of God in the past have been like thunder.

He was on the ground at the time when Christ presented himself to John for baptism. He heard the majestic voice resounding through Heaven and echoing through the earth like peals of thunder. He saw the lightnings flash from the cloudless heavens, and heard the fearful words from Jehovah, "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased." He saw the brightness of the Father's glory overshadowing the form of Jesus, thus pointing out in that crowd the One whom he acknowledged as his Son with unmistakable assurance. The circumstances connected with this baptismal scene had aroused the most intense hatred in the breast of Satan. He knew then for a certainty that unless he could overcome Christ, from thenceforth there would be a limitation of his power. He understood that the communication from the throne of God signified that Heaven was more directly accessible to man.  {ST, April 5, 1883 par. 6} 

In love, with a desire to elevate and ennoble us, God provided for us a standard of obedience. In awful majesty, amid thundering and lightning, he proclaimed from Mount Sinai his ten holy precepts. This law reveals the whole duty of the human family; the first four precepts define our duty to God, and the last six our duty to man. A certain lawyer came to Christ, and tempted him, saying: "Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."  {ST, March 4, 1897 par. 3} 

A possible reason why the 7 thunders were not allowed to be written down by either prophet.

God's holy law was not instituted at Sinai, altho it was there first proclaimed. The thunder and lightnings that enveloped Sinai presented a scene of awe and terror which no voice or pen can describe. The splendor and majesty of God's glory there revealed caused the people whom he had rescued from the bondage of Egypt to tremble with fear. And as they heard the voice of God amid the smoke and the fire, the thunderings and the lightnings, and the noise of a trumpet, they moved afar off from the mount, and said unto Moses, "Speak thou with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us, lest we die.  {ST, July 29, 1897 par. 3} 

On the morning of the third day, as the eyes of all the people were turned toward the mount, its summit was covered with a thick cloud, which grew more black and dense, sweeping downward until the entire mountain was wrapped in darkness and awful mystery. Then a sound as of a trumpet was heard, summoning the people to meet with God; and Moses led them forth to the base of the mountain. From the thick darkness flashed vivid lightnings, while peals of thunder echoed and re-echoed among the surrounding heights. . . . {CTr 114.3}

The thunders ceased; the trumpet was no longer heard; the earth was still. There was a period of solemn silence, and then the voice of God was heard. Speaking out of the thick darkness that enshrouded Him, as He stood upon the mount, surrounded by a retinue of angels, the Lord made known His law. . . . {CTr 114.4}

------------    ----------------------     --------------------------     --------------


This is now the counting of the statements in red uttered by God at the close of probation up to the 2nd coming of Christ.


(1) I saw angels hurrying to and fro in heaven. An angel returned from the earth with a writer's ink-horn by his side, and reported to Jesus that his work was done, that the saints were numbered and sealed. Then I saw Jesus, who had been ministering before the ark containing the ten commandments, throw down the censer. He raised his hands upward, and with a loud voice said, It is done. And all the angelic host laid off their crowns as Jesus made the solemn declaration, He that is unjust, let him be unjust still; and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still; and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still; and he that is holy, let him be holy still.  {1SG 197.2} 

Rev. 8:5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake. 6: And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.

(2) Rev. 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
13: And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

(3) Rev. 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done. 18: And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

Rev. 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.


(4.5) The sky opened and shut, and was in commotion. The mountains shook like a reed in the wind, and cast out ragged rocks all around. The sea boiled like a pot, and cast out stones upon the land. And as God spake the day and hour of Jesus' coming, and delivered the everlasting covenant to his people, he spake one sentence, and then paused, while the words were rolling through the earth. The Israel of God stood with their eyes fixed upwards, listening to the words as they came from the mouth of Jehovah, and rolled through the earth like peals of loudest thunder. It was awfully solemn. At the end of every sentence the saints shouted, Glory! Hallelujah! Their countenances were lighted up with the glory of God; and they shone with the glory as did Moses' face when he came down from Sinai. The wicked could not look on them for the glory. And when the never-ending blessing was pronounced on those who had honored God, in keeping his Sabbath holy, there was a mighty shout of victory over the beast, and over his image.  {1SG 205.3} 

The streams ceased to flow. Dark, heavy clouds came up, and clashed against each other. But there was one clear place of settled glory, from whence came the voice of God, like many waters, which shook the heavens and the earth. There was a mighty earthquake. The graves were shaken open, and those who had died in faith under the third angel's message, keeping the Sabbath, came forth from their dusty beds, glorified, to hear the covenant of peace that God was to make with those who had kept his law.  {1SG 205.2} 

Greater wonders than have yet been seen will be witnessed by these upon the earth a short time previous to the coming of Christ. "And I will show wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke." "And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great." "And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found. And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent; and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great."  {ST, March 13, 1879 }


(6), (7) Then the angels ceased to sing, and there was some time of awful silence, when Jesus spoke. Those who have clean hands and a pure heart shall be able to stand, my grace is sufficient for you. At this, our faces lighted up, and joy filled every heart. And the angels struck a note higher and sung again while the cloud drew still nearer the earth. Then Jesus' silver trumpet sounded, as he descended on the cloud, wrapped in flames of fire. He gazed on the graves of the sleeping saints, then raised his eyes and hands to heaven and cried, Awake! Awake! Awake! ye that sleep in the dust and arise. Then there was a mighty earthquake. The graves opened, and the dead came up clothed with immortality.(Experience and Views 1846 & 1851 p. 12)


Just in doing this study, I am overwhelmed by the awesome power of these descriptions of the end time events..  interested in any comment or additional information gathered....
« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 09:52:46 AM by NB » Logged
earlysda
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« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2010, 07:23:12 PM »

Sublimely Awesome.
We do serve a mighty, and awesome God.

I haven't done even a short study on the Thunders, but one thing bothered me about the traditional explanation is that it assigns it to the past, so it makes us not really interested in studying Revelation 10 for today.  Maybe we should?

Another thing is, that i've gotten the feeling before, and strengthened by your quotes here, that there are 2 times in the future when God will say "It is done".  Once is when Jesus is still in the Most Holy Place pleading our cases, and then announces that his ministration is over, the other is right at the time when the Father gives the day and hour of Jesus' coming.

On a somewhat related note, i've always been taught that no one will know, not even Satan will know, when the Close of Probation has come and gone, but it is very, very clear that not only will Satan know, the whole world will know.  I wonder how many other things we've been "taught" we will have to unlearn to arrive at the pure truth....

What are the books represented by DD and CC?
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NB
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« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2010, 08:01:51 PM »

CC conflict and courage
DD darkness before dawn   update:  I took these references out and stuck with older originals and bible...

"It is done"  Rev. 8:1: And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.
2: And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.
3: And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne.
4: And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand.
5: And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake.
6: And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.

Do you think we will know this?  Maybe only the 'wise' will understand...  Others will think it just more of the same stuff all along?Huh  I wonder where we got the idea that we would not know when probation closed for the world?

The idea that no one will know the day or the hour I think is misunderstood....  the way the bible reads is a bit awkward in that it could be understood that no one will proclaim the day and the hour except the Father from heaven.  So, it seems to me that the announcement will come only from Him.

Like I said, there may be some adjustments needed here but I think we can really get the idea that something major is going to happen as the voice of God speaks and the earth churns and shifts and rolls with the thunderous power that no pen or voice could ever describe accurately.

We may have to wait for prophetic answers to really understand fully.  Let me know if you find out anything else..

Rev. 10  is definitely linked to these happenings ... coincides with Daniel 12 almost word for word.

Rev. 11 is important too....

« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 09:54:23 AM by NB » Logged
earlysda
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« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2010, 06:10:33 PM »

So are there 2 different times for the "It is done" statement?
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NB
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« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2010, 10:17:19 AM »

So are there 2 different times for the "It is done" statement?

I believe so....  first the Son and then from the Father....  amazing isn't it...  Maybe I should give it a separate number Huh 
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earlysda
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« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2010, 05:36:29 PM »

That would be good to make it a separate study.
I don't think hardly anyone knows about this.
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NB
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« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2010, 06:09:49 PM »

That would be good to make it a separate study.
I don't think hardly anyone knows about this.

Only because most of those in the church believe that the thunders already happened with the 1st and 2nd AM so they are thrown off the track by thinking it is in the past.  Even those few that think it is in the future still attribute the thunders to the proclaiming of the messages by righteous men.  I really doubt that man in any shape or form could ever have the Voice that will cause thunderings and rippling EQs on this whole earth. 

I think it is exciting to see that the thunders are the actual words and voice of God as He speaks to the earth.  Wow!  And, both prophets were told not to write it down and EGW says that no pen or voice could ever describe the thunders!!  Glory glory glory!!


I believe that these 'thunderings' not only proclaim judgment messages but the end ones actually move all the land masses of the earth together so that when Jesus comes, every eye will see Him at the same time.  That was another study that I posted somewhere....
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 06:11:55 PM by NB » Logged
NB
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« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2010, 10:30:54 AM »

I went back and made a few changes... tell me what you think now...

I think this is more sequential..... 


Until then, I will leave it as such....   Cheesy
« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 09:55:16 AM by NB » Logged
earlysda
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« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2010, 06:26:13 PM »

It looks good to me NB.  I don't really see the difference in this edit, but somehow it seems a little more connected than i remember it before.
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NB
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« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2010, 08:16:51 AM »

It looks good to me NB.  I don't really see the difference in this edit, but somehow it seems a little more connected than i remember it before.

   Grin  trust me, I did edit ....  I went back and used sources of the originals and bible only....  I praise the Lord for this study... and hope that others will be blessed.  And, if anything does not look right please advise... 

God Bless
« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 07:57:26 AM by NB » Logged
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